Western Conference Pension Trust

planedoctor · Joined: Oct 08, 2002 Posts: 306

As a bunch of my fellow employees have been unloading around the water cooler about this topic I thought I would throw some stuff out to get the discussion going....maybe!

As most of us know the Teamsters would love for us to be "in" with them in the WCTPT.

There is a ton of stuff out there about how bad it is, how good it is. The union is promoting the fact that its fully funded and that we need it because the company is going to cease contributing to ours soon.

Although I would probably bet that being one of the only major air carriers with a pension plan is something that can't last for ever in today's "stab your employees in their back" kinda world, I don't think jumping ship is the best thing to do.

Although I wouldn't say the WCTPT is a better deal then CAL's deal, I do know having a contingency plan is.

I would rather see us getting a contingency plan that if down the road Cal stops contributions that we get the money to invest, spend or give as we please.

Today's word is a way different place that is was in the early days of Aviation. People have learned to invest in the markets and can easily set up and manage their own portfolio.

I couldn't see why if the company is willing to contribute $4 (or whatever it is) an hour to an employees pension plan now why they wouldn't be will to negotiate an amount for individuals to manage themselves.

If the company stops contributing to our pensions they probably wont want to contribute to any one else's.

Folks it really isn't what we call ourselves but how well we band together to address the things that matter the most to us.

Let's get to work !!!!!

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planedoctor · Joined: Oct 08, 2002 Posts: 306

After hearing the sales pitch the other day I have a little more understanding of this trust.

There are a lot of good things this plan has to offer.

Does it beat the CARP?

The jury is still out, but it's really a close race.

Personally I'm torn. On one hand I would like to flexibility of having my money to do as I please. Please read this Chicago Sun Times Article

Adding to this delima please read this Brief by the Boston College Center for Retirement Research.

Further reading comparing the two could be found HERE.

Like anything it all comes down to personal choice. Do you entrust your retirement monies to professionals to invest and live with cofidance you will have "X" when you retire or retain and fully bear the weight of investing on yourself and hope you make wise choices.
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DC8guru · Joined: Sep 16, 2007 Posts: 5 Location: USA

I am tired of our union attempting to force us to accept only teamsters plans. There are other alternatives out there that we should look at and "Only" if CAL stops CARP. Like the PlaneDoctor said, Who says CAL will contribute to the West Plan if they wont contribute to a plan of their own?

planedoctor · Joined: Oct 08, 2002 Posts: 306

I agree with you DC8guru that there's certainly other plans out there. From what I have heard from every union official is that they are open to us exploring other plans. From what they said this was a very good and well respected trust and has been around for 50+ years.

I know there has been talks between coworkers about some type of defined 401K program also. I would be interested in viewing something else just for comparison.

The thing most don't get is that this trust has nothing to do with the Teamsters other then half of the board of trustees belong to the union and the other half are from the companies that contribute. These Union Trustees are elected. I don't know the exact procedure, but they are.

I know there are those out there that hate the Teamsters and feel they are getting screwed by them and this trust is just another way for them to control their money.

Do you think the Ex employees of ENRON thought their company wouldn't screw them?

How about Eastern? How about Pan Am? How about United?

These days anyone can get ripped off by anyone.

I really feel if the majority doesnt want a change with their retirement then nothing will happen.

So tell me DC8guru, what are some of the main points you don't like about this plan?

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DC8guru · Joined: Sep 16, 2007 Posts: 5 Location: USA

I am not real sure of the specics in the plan or even the CARP plan. I do however wonder why our teamster reps are pushing this plan and only this plan. You are probably correct in saying that if the company, union, government or any other finiancial corporation wants to stick it to us little people, there is not much we can do. On the otherhand, if we sit idle, they will certainly do just that.

planedoctor · Joined: Oct 08, 2002 Posts: 306

I think it really falls to this.

The best type of retirement plan as far as security of the funds is the largest plan and the one that has the most diversity in investing and contributors.

They categorize pension plans as either single or multi-employer plans.

We can all understand single employer plans, but multi-employer plans needs something that is common to all the employees contributing to it. With the WCTPT that would be two fold. Must be from the west coast states and must be teamsters.

Now I'm not promoting this trust or telling you it's bad here, just giving the facts as I see them. I haven't made up my mind personally on this.

The good thing about WCTPT if that there are a lot of diverse industries contributing to this. If one industry takes a hit, it doesn't hurt the trust as much. Same goes for comparing this with a defined 401K. WCTPT has assets that are in real estate and investments other then the market.

As security goes it(WCTPT) seems really strong! On that topic look what happened to EAL, TWA and Pan Am that could happen again (never say never) with a chunk of our money outside of our employers hands at least if they folded we wouldn't loose our jobs and pensions.

Diversity is a very good thing also.

The 401K type plans seems enticing for the potential large return, but the lack of security that comes with fluctuating markets makes it a tough sale. Could you imagine retiring right before the market shake up in 2000!!!

In some ways I would rather take the lesser money in trade for the security of knowing I would get X when I retire GUARENTEED verses a potential higher yield that isn't secure.

Guess that's why I would rather have less pay and have rock solid work rules and scope and benefits then top dollar and crap for scope and work rules.

I just don't want to worry about "Will I have a job, will I have some retirement" If I know I make X and will have X when I retire I can adjust my lifestyle accordingly.
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